[NTLK] NewtonTalk Digest, Vol 32, Issue 19

John Gamble johnny_gamble at hotmail.com
Mon Aug 29 04:29:51 EDT 2016


If we were going to build a new 'bootstrap' card, what would it contain? My thoughts are:
- Unprotect
- Blunt
- ATA driver
- Wifi drivers (although I question the usefulness of them because in today's world having an unprotected network, or using WEP passwords is SUPER dodgy)
- A few free games? (Glider, daleks...etc)

Two other ideas for discussion:
- It could be good to have some kind of a Newton wiki where all of this information is contained.
- Physical cables... there's a few companies that do USB the DIN-8 cables (with current drivers). How hard would it be to recreate the male interconnect plug so that we don't need to distribute cards? Rightly or wrongly I can picture a day when even low capacity cards are rare and people need to rely on modern cards (that require the ata driver).


> On 29 Aug 2016, at 5:03 PM, "newtontalk-request at newtontalk.net" <newtontalk-request at newtontalk.net> wrote:
> 
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> Today's Topics:
> 
>   1. Re: NewtonTalk Digest, Vol 32, Issue 15 (Jeff Fischbach)
>   2. Re: Bootstrapping (late-to-the-game) (Jeff Fischbach)
>   3. Re: Bootstrapping (Jeff Fischbach)
>   4. Re: Bootstrapping (Jeff Fischbach)
>   5. Re: Bootstrapping (late-to-the-game) (Jeffrey Kleinberg)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 01:05:07 -0700
> From: Jeff Fischbach <jmfischbach at gmail.com>
> To: newtontalk at newtontalk.net
> Subject: Re: [NTLK] NewtonTalk Digest, Vol 32, Issue 15
> Message-ID:
>    <CAPERds4cKVBg+jWQWfzt_49Af27_FO5U8wG669wROu8sqc2e-Q at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> 
> It's the classic "chicken & egg" dilemma. But, I'm encouraged that anyone's
> still here. I'm a mentor for teenaged programmers on a high school robotics
> team. I like bringing in functioning retro tech, adapted as necessary, just
> to give them perspective.
> 
> Is there anyone who might be able to copy a decent set of requisites
> (wifi/ethernet, at the least), if I mailed a decent linear PCMCIA? (I was
> kind of hoping to meet the famous "Frank", since I'm an avid
> hiker/Geocacher, and we don't live horribly far from each other.)
> 
> On Aug 26, 2016 10:01 PM, "Vladislav Korotnev" <vladkorotnev at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
>>        To put it simpler:
>>        You have a Newton and e.g. a WiFi network. You want to use the
>> network to install packages on the Newton so you buy a WiFi card. But it
>> turns out you need to install drivers for it and you don?t have a cable.
>> Which means you have to install them using your WiFi. But to use your WiFi
>> you need to install them. But to install them you need to use your WiFi.
>> But to use your WiFi?
>>        Bootstrap cards are cards preloaded with those common drivers
>> (most of the time, NIE and WiFi/Bluetooth/ATA drivers) so you could get out
>> of this loop by loading the drivers from the bootstrap card, connecting
>> your Newt to your WiFi and installing them to your Newt permanently. After
>> you do that you don?t need to load them from the card anymore, so you
>> return it to the original owner.
>>        Simple as that :)
>> 
>> 
>> // Ak.R.
>> 
>> iOS/Mac/Windows & Web developer
>> Vaporwave/ambient producer, sound/video engineer
>> 
>> Genjitsu Gadget Lab Member 001
>> http://genjit.su
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 26 Aug 2016, at 23:21 , L.W. Brown <lwb at mac.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> That much even I say  ;-]
>>> A rough-but-ready translation: an insertable ?card" with certain
>> software on it that you need to install, but that also needs to be
>> available during boot-up so that non-original-but-still-necessary
>> functions can be performed; having that software on an inserted card during
>> boot-up allows the functions to be completed during boot-up, and then
>> allows the function-programs to be installed more permanently on the Newt
>> after boot-up.
>>> Usually boot-strap cards were loaned among members of our little
>> community, but it?s been a while, so none may be left...
>>> 
>>> L.W. Brown
>>> LwBrown at Mail.com
>>> 
>>>> On Aug 26, 2016, at 10:51 AM, Michael Sheflin <sheflinm at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I'm even later to the game.  What's a bootstrap card?
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> 
>>> http://newtontalk.net/
>>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
>> 
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> 
>> http://newtontalk.net/
>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 08:05:59 -0700
> From: Jeff Fischbach <jmfischbach at gmail.com>
> To: newtontalk at newtontalk.net
> Subject: Re: [NTLK] Bootstrapping (late-to-the-game)
> Message-ID:
>    <CAPERds5aqSvFOOzm7EJDjhScn+=pvkrc9yJy2EjL8prUJDMhkw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> 
> Fantastic! That's awesome! I'm in Los Angeles  (Work: 9909 Topanga Canyon
> Blvd. #205, Chatsworth CA 91311)
> 
> On Aug 27, 2016 4:11 AM, Piotrowski Pawe? (Newton) <newton at indigi.co.uk>
> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Jeff!
>> 
>> What is your location?
>> 
>> I can give you WiFi card and maybe I?ll find some PCMCIA blank.
>> 
>> 
>> Best regards,
>> Pawel Piotrowski
>> 
>> NPDS Server: http://newton1.applenewton.co.uk (powered by Newton 2100)
>> NPDS Tracker Server: http://tracker.applenewton.co.uk:3680 (powered by
>> Raspberry Pi)
>> 
>> 
>> On 25 Aug 2016, at 22:15, Jeff M. Fischbach, ABFE <jeff at secondwave.com>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi all! I've wanted a Newton since the day I first laid my hands on one
>> in
>>> the 90's. I was young, and poor. (Now, I'm old and poor.) But, I finally
>>> got one (an MP2000). Unfortunately, it came with nothing, but an empty
>>> battery holder, a stylus & ONE PCMCIA blank. But, it works great! Now,
>> I'd
>>> like to bootstrap it & put it on my network. Fortunately, I have the kind
>>> of kids (pre-teen & teen) who really appreciate classic tech.
>>> 
>>> I was wondering if anyone is still lending bootstrap cards.
>>> 
>>> Hopefully, I'm not late, but rather early for the next Newton
>> anniversary.
>>> Thanks!
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> 
>>> http://newtontalk.net/
>>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> 
>> http://newtontalk.net/
>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 09:19:02 -0700
> From: Jeff Fischbach <jmfischbach at gmail.com>
> To: newtontalk at newtontalk.net
> Subject: Re: [NTLK] Bootstrapping
> Message-ID:
>    <CAPERds7kinYOAddgQdby8rWKdenX=gG3epsiCapkA+_4xqv4DA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> 
> You're absolutely right. The problem comes in terms of evolving the use of
> the device beyond stock. Effectively, the MP is a "walled garden". These
> days, it's become difficult to interface with it. The community has clearly
> done a lot, where Apple stopped it's updates.
> 
> In my case, I don't even have the proper cabling. But, that's just an
> economic hurtle. For around  $60, I could ebay the MP2000 serial connector,
> then interface that with a usb to serial adapter, and install drivers,
> designed by enthusiasts via a transfer program, also designed by
> enthusiasts. All to utilize a wifi card that makes the rest unnecessary and
> obsolete.
> 
> Or, with proper drivers on a memory card, and an Ethernet/Wi-Fi card, all
> that can be circumvented. It's a shortcut.
> 
>> On Aug 27, 2016 9:05 AM, "Gene Beaird" <bgbeaird at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> 
>> I thought a MP2K would boot without a memory card installed.  Isn't the OS
>> installed on the ROM built in to the device?
>> 
>> Gene Beaird,
>> Pearland, Texas
>> 
>>> On Aug 27, 2016, at 11:00 AM, newtontalk-request at newtontalk.net wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ------------------------------
>>> 
>>> Message: 2
>>> Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 11:21:18 -0700
>>> From: "L.W. Brown" <lwb at mac.com>
>>> To: newtontalk at newtontalk.net
>>> Subject: Re: [NTLK] NewtonTalk Digest, Vol 32, Issue 15
>>> Message-ID: <B69AF2CC-B119-455F-9332-5E26D8F9EF9A at mac.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>> 
>>> That much even I say  ;-]
>>> A rough-but-ready translation: an insertable ?card" with certain
>> software on it that you need to install, but that also needs to be
>> available during boot-up so that non-original-but-still-necessary
>> functions can be performed; having that software on an inserted card during
>> boot-up allows the functions to be completed during boot-up, and then
>> allows the function-programs to be installed more permanently on the Newt
>> after boot-up.
>>> Usually boot-strap cards were loaned among members of our little
>> community, but it?s been a while, so none may be left...
>>> 
>>> L.W. Brown
>>> LwBrown at Mail.com
>>> 
>>>> On Aug 26, 2016, at 10:51 AM, Michael Sheflin <sheflinm at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I'm even later to the game.  What's a bootstrap card?
>> 
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> 
>> http://newtontalk.net/
>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 09:20:28 -0700
> From: Jeff Fischbach <jmfischbach at gmail.com>
> To: newtontalk at newtontalk.net
> Subject: Re: [NTLK] Bootstrapping
> Message-ID:
>    <CAPERds5TknU2xaKsC=6q-+C6N1H7CptvmofYGsQ8qfkEnXSF5g at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> 
> BTW, I have close friends in Pearland. Spent some time there a few years
> back. Seems like a great community.
> 
>> On Aug 27, 2016 9:19 AM, "Jeff Fischbach" <jmfischbach at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> You're absolutely right. The problem comes in terms of evolving the use of
>> the device beyond stock. Effectively, the MP is a "walled garden". These
>> days, it's become difficult to interface with it. The community has clearly
>> done a lot, where Apple stopped it's updates.
>> 
>> In my case, I don't even have the proper cabling. But, that's just an
>> economic hurtle. For around  $60, I could ebay the MP2000 serial connector,
>> then interface that with a usb to serial adapter, and install drivers,
>> designed by enthusiasts via a transfer program, also designed by
>> enthusiasts. All to utilize a wifi card that makes the rest unnecessary and
>> obsolete.
>> 
>> Or, with proper drivers on a memory card, and an Ethernet/Wi-Fi card, all
>> that can be circumvented. It's a shortcut.
>> 
>>> On Aug 27, 2016 9:05 AM, "Gene Beaird" <bgbeaird at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I thought a MP2K would boot without a memory card installed.  Isn't the
>>> OS installed on the ROM built in to the device?
>>> 
>>> Gene Beaird,
>>> Pearland, Texas
>>> 
>>>> On Aug 27, 2016, at 11:00 AM, newtontalk-request at newtontalk.net wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>> 
>>>> Message: 2
>>>> Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 11:21:18 -0700
>>>> From: "L.W. Brown" <lwb at mac.com>
>>>> To: newtontalk at newtontalk.net
>>>> Subject: Re: [NTLK] NewtonTalk Digest, Vol 32, Issue 15
>>>> Message-ID: <B69AF2CC-B119-455F-9332-5E26D8F9EF9A at mac.com>
>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>>> 
>>>> That much even I say  ;-]
>>>> A rough-but-ready translation: an insertable ?card" with certain
>>> software on it that you need to install, but that also needs to be
>>> available during boot-up so that non-original-but-still-necessary
>>> functions can be performed; having that software on an inserted card during
>>> boot-up allows the functions to be completed during boot-up, and then
>>> allows the function-programs to be installed more permanently on the Newt
>>> after boot-up.
>>>> Usually boot-strap cards were loaned among members of our little
>>> community, but it?s been a while, so none may be left...
>>>> 
>>>> L.W. Brown
>>>> LwBrown at Mail.com
>>>> 
>>>>> On Aug 26, 2016, at 10:51 AM, Michael Sheflin <sheflinm at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> I'm even later to the game.  What's a bootstrap card?
>>> 
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> 
>>> http://newtontalk.net/
>>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2016 18:28:09 -0400
> From: Jeffrey Kleinberg <pontiac970 at icloud.com>
> To: newtontalk at newtontalk.net
> Cc: Kleinberg Jeffrey <pontiac970 at icloud.com>
> Subject: Re: [NTLK] Bootstrapping (late-to-the-game)
> Message-ID: <BFA09728-38B5-4BFF-8C6E-DEC69CBEEBB8 at icloud.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset=utf-8
> 
> Do you know my friend Randy Michel from West hills?
> 
> Jeffrey Kleinberg
> 
> 
> pontiac970 at mac.com
> 
> C 914-525-4665
> 
> 
> 
>> On Aug 27, 2016, at 6:22 PM, Jeff M. Fischbach, ABFE <jeff at secondwave.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Sorry, I've been replying, but realized I wasn't using the same account I
>> used to register.
>> 
>> That sounds fantastic! That's awesome! I'm looking forward to putting this
>> MP into the current decade, and maybe converting a couple of kids from the
>> high school robotics team. (Turns out, retro-tech is cool.)
>> 
>> I'm in Los Angeles  (Work: 9909 Topanga Canyon Blvd. #205, Chatsworth CA
>> 91311)
>> 
>> 
>> Jeff Michael Fischbach, ABFE <jeff at secondwave.com>
>> Board Certified Forensic Technologist (ABFE #12891)
>> SecondWave, Inc. <http://secondwave.com>
>> 9909 Topanga Canyon Blvd., #205, Chatsworth, CA 91311, USA
>> 
>> WARNING: This message may contain HAZARDOUS DATA. See: http://HazDat.com.
>> 
>> PH:       818.773.0400 /  eFAX: 818-337-2255
>> Twitter:  http://twitter.com/HazDat
>> IM:        jeffsecondwave (AIM/MSN/Yahoo/Skype) jmfischbach (GTalk) 9421924
>> (ICQ)
>> 
>> Cal:       http://calendar.secondwave.com
>> CV:       http://cv.JeffFischbach.com <http://cv.secondwave.com>
>> Cont:     http://contact.secondwave.com
>> 
>> This correspondence is covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy
>> Act, 18 U.S.C. 2510-2521, and may contain privileged and confidential
>> material. It is intended to be read ONLY by the named recipient(s). If you
>> have received this message in error please notify the sender and discard
>> immediately. Any dissemination, distribution or copying of the
>> communication is strictly prohibited.
>> 
>> On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 4:11 AM, "Piotrowski Pawe? (Newton)" <
>> newton at indigi.co.uk> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi Jeff!
>>> 
>>> What is your location?
>>> 
>>> I can give you WiFi card and maybe I?ll find some PCMCIA blank.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Best regards,
>>> Pawel Piotrowski
>>> 
>>> NPDS Server: http://newton1.applenewton.co.uk (powered by Newton 2100)
>>> NPDS Tracker Server: http://tracker.applenewton.co.uk:3680 (powered by
>>> Raspberry Pi)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 25 Aug 2016, at 22:15, Jeff M. Fischbach, ABFE <jeff at secondwave.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hi all! I've wanted a Newton since the day I first laid my hands on one
>>> in
>>>> the 90's. I was young, and poor. (Now, I'm old and poor.) But, I finally
>>>> got one (an MP2000). Unfortunately, it came with nothing, but an empty
>>>> battery holder, a stylus & ONE PCMCIA blank. But, it works great! Now,
>>> I'd
>>>> like to bootstrap it & put it on my network. Fortunately, I have the kind
>>>> of kids (pre-teen & teen) who really appreciate classic tech.
>>>> 
>>>> I was wondering if anyone is still lending bootstrap cards.
>>>> 
>>>> Hopefully, I'm not late, but rather early for the next Newton
>>> anniversary.
>>>> Thanks!
>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> 
>>>> http://newtontalk.net/
>>>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> 
>>> http://newtontalk.net/
>>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> 
>> http://newtontalk.net/
>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> http://newtontalk.net/
> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
> 
> End of NewtonTalk Digest, Vol 32, Issue 19
> ******************************************


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